Monday, December 29, 2014

Dayalu Nitai Sundar Das Exposed (Part 1): Nimai Pandit Das Mail to Raghava Pandit Dasa

Hare Krishna Dear Raghava Pandit Prabhu, Please accept my humble obeisances! All Glories to Srila Prabhupada!

One of the elderly friends said, "My dear Maṇḍalībhadra, why are you wielding a shining sword as though you were running toward Ariṣṭāsura to kill him? My dear Baladeva, why are You unnecessarily bearing that heavy plow? My dear Vijaya, don't be unnecessarily agitated. My dear Bhadravardhana, there is no need to make these threatening motions. If you will all look more closely you will see that it is only a thunder cloud upon Govardhana Hill; it is not the Ariṣṭāsura in the shape of a bull, as you have imagined."

These older, well-wishing friends of Kṛṣṇa had imagined a large cloud to be the Ariṣṭāsura, appearing in the shape of a huge bull. In the midst of their excitement one of them ascertained that it was actually only a cloud on Govardhan Hill. He therefore informed the others not to take the trouble of worrying about Kṛṣṇa, because there was no present danger from Ariṣṭāsura.
(Nectar of devotion - Chapter Forty-one)

Thank you for your letter and invitation for the Istagoshti. I will definitely be present on 6th Nov. 10 am for the Istagoshti.

But I would first like to see that we set the ground rules for the Istagosthi as there has been a great confusion created which has spoiled the right mood for the Istagoshti. You write that it is due to me. I do not know what you mean by that. All I am hearing is a lot of loose talk, rumors, fears etc.

So let me make it completely clear ONCE FOR ALL.

NONE of your temple brahmacaris have been contacted by me- ---either by phone or email or in any other manner like through other devotees or any other way.

NONE of your congregation devotees have been contacted by me ---either by phone or email or in any other manner like through other devotees or any other way.

NONE of the parents of children in the gurukul have been contacted by me ----either by phone or email or in any other manner like through other devotees or any other way.

NONE of your hostel boys have been contacted by me ---either by phone or email or in any other manner like through other devotees or any other way.

NONE of your regular donors have been contacted by me - either by phone or email or in any other manner like through other devotees or any other way.

NONE of the foreign devotees outside of Rajasthan have been contacted by me.


There was no plan other then to hold an Istagosthi.


There have been a total of 6 devotees whom I have been in communication with about these issues. You will all see as we go down the list that these are the devotees, who are running their own preaching in Rajasthan and an older friend of Dayalu Prabhu - Vedvit Prabhu.  

I contacted them as communication with Dayalu Prabhu had broken down since I met him in March with Murali Mohan Prabhu at your center when I understood that he is unfortunately becoming a blind follower of immature Mmp and that talking to him alone is of no use, it will only create further enmity.

I felt that he has become enamored by Mmp, his “purity” and how he feels mistakenly believes that Mmp alone has cured him of the long term mental disease that he now even wants to give him Sannyasa per his last email!

This is craziness.

Mmp has barely joined the temple 2 years back, does not have almost any preaching experience to non-devotees (gone on Sankirtan for a few days not even weeks), and does not chant well and regularly sleeps during chanting and classes.  

He has many good qualities, he is a devotee like all of you are, but are these the symptoms of an advanced devotee or a Sannyasi?!

THAT IS ONLY MAIN CONCERN OF MINE. All other concerns are flowing from this main point- brahmacari is superior etc. all are preached by him and accepted by Dayalu Prabhu now and hence preached to all.

I am not offending Mmp but being discriminatory as per Rupa Goswami’s advise in NOI.

The main query from me Dayalu Prabhu has not addressed in his email:
1.    How is Mmp certified by him as a “real brahmana”?
2.    How is Mmp despite sleeping regularly during chanting, in the class, considered a high class devotee?
(I now hear that he is explaining that Mmp sleeps during chanting as he goes out / was going out for Karma Kandiya Pujas till late at night----I do not know whether to be amused or cry with this argument!)

3.    How is it that a new brahmacari, however nice he is, who has not even gone on regular Sankirtan, he is giving guidance on all issues of Sankirtan mission, and Dayalu Prabhu is asking all of you, who go out on regular Sankirtan for Lord Caitanya’s service, to take guidance from him?

I would not have had so much of an issue with this but for the reason that all you devotees have been progressing nicely trying to take guidance from Srila Prabhupada, coming closer to Srila Prabhupada, and that was my happiness.
But then Dayalu Prabhu started preaching to me in our last meeting that this “is Sahajiya platform” to try to take guidance from Srila Prabhupada through his books! Now gradually he has started preaching this more and more at the center and to the devotees in the congregation and others to instead take guidance from Mmp as we cannot understand Srila Prabhupada’s books directly or get guidance from him directly.

This is the main point I CANNOT TOLERATE.

His angry reaction to my bringing up this unpleasing topic to his notice is to- try to KILL THE MESSENGER-me, rather then to address Mmp’s lack of qualifications for his artificial elevation.

Hence is it any wonder that after sensing his surrender to Mmp, and his narrow mindset then, back in March, I decided to keep aloof from the center and its devotees, and when the circumstances came such that I had to do something to keep some devotees sane who were leaving the center association due to these issues, and as I hoped that preaching together in Rajasthan would be beneficial to all, and as Dayalu Prabhu was writing to me regularly asking me to respond to various queries, I decided to approach a group of senior devotees in Jaipur, devotees who are running their independent preaching locally and his friend like Vedvitt Prabhu to resolve this issue within mature discussions. This is so that cooperation could be there for combined preaching.

Group of TPs body

This is the prescribed method given by Srila Prabhupada to resolve issues with other leaders, given there is no GBC yet as was the case before GBC was formed in 1970.(He asked TPs in West Coast and East Coast Temple Presidents of USA to come together and resolve simple issues before GBC formation).

And this was one of the main resolutions from the March Prabhupadanuga meeting held at your center under your hosting. We all participated in the meeting- held around March 1-3rd 2013 at your center, with other visiting devotees and when the issue – how to appoint Ritviks was being discussed. So the end resolution which Dayalu Prabhu happily accepted and wanted to do and announced, was for him to organize all the devotees who are running their independent preaching centers, in Rajasthan and probably in India, if possible, in the next 6 months or so – by Kartik 2013, as a body of TPs.

Then in Kartik 2013, which is now, he was then going to bring this topic up there, maybe who will elect ritivks or maybe elect a GBC who will appoint ritviks and then hold elections.

Please inquire from any devotee attending that meeting - Was it not so? What happened to that?

I am forwarding this email to Balarama Prabhu from Turkey who was present at that meeting, for his comments.

These are the group of devotees I communicated with for resolving these issues with Dayalu Prabhu so that cooperation among all could be established on an even keel.

Some of them have been communicating with me about these issues from earlier rest got involved as part of organizing the Istagoshti.

As mentioned earlier, NONE of your congregation devotees, NONE of your brahmacaris, NONE of your hostel boys, NONE of your regular donors, NONE of the parents of Gurukul children or anyone else not already running or preaching separately from your center was even touched or disturbed about these issues. I had no intention to involve anyone other then mature devotees, whom we had already resolved to be made a body of devotees to resolve issues including ritvik appointments etc.

I hope this is proof is enough for all sane personas that I had no intention to disturb all yours preaching efforts that are nicely already going on.

As far as some of the devotees in the world, who are now jumping on Dayalu Prabhu’s angry bandwagon to get back at me, let them write to me directly and openly, organize an Istagoshti among senior devotees at their location, to resolve the issues with me and preach to me in that association. This is Srila Prabhupada’s prescribed method to resolve issues, NOT THIS WRITING BEHIND THE BACK PHUS PHUS PHUS WITHOUT GIVING ME SUFFICIENT CHANCE TO PUT MINE AND OTHER’S SIDE.

However one is considered “senior” and “advanced” let them follow this basic symptom – of being straight forward in one’s dealings-and thereby we will judge.

Hence it seems to me that it has been made such a big issue, or an issue at all among most of the devotees for NO REASON. Most devotees would not have come to know of my issues at all.

The 6 devotees whom I forwarded this email and invited to join the Istagoahti are:–

Independent preaching in RAJ. - Prema Bhakti Prabhu, Chanchal Prabhu, Madan Mohan Prabhu and Abhay Charan Prabhu.

Independent preacher in Jaipur – Kuva Prabhu

Old friend of Dayalu Prabhu and mine – Vedvitt Prabhu who left his job in Singapore and came to Jaipur to work with Dayalu Prabhu but has gotten fried. We both are the only 2 devotees who have been friends of Dayalu Prabhu for maybe 20 years and can still speak to him about his difficulties, and he to us. Hence in our normal talk when these topics came up we thought it will be a good idea for me to come to Jaipur and try to sort out these issues by sitting together.

The 3 below devotees whom Dayalu Prabhu is incorrectly calling “his congregation devotees” while also acknowledging that they are having their preaching center’s independently.

Prema Bhakti Prabhu, Chanchal Prabhu and Madan Mohan Prabhu.

How are they “his congregation devotees”? They have their own congregation.

The definition Dayalu Prabhu himself gave in March Prabhupadanugas meeting for Prema Bhakti Prabhu to be part of that group of “TPs” was of “independent preaching center like Prema Bhakti Prabhu’s in Gopalgarh”. That time you were to be sent to Jodhpur to preach and hence even though you were not already gone and were still living in Jpr center, he was calling you a “TP” for that purpose. Hence including HKC Jaipur, he was saying there are 3 centers in Raj. And also Hari Mohan Prabhu…and other devotees were being talked about. Dayalu Prabhu was lamenting that he did not invite Hari Mohan Prabhu for the Prabhupadanugas gathering for this reason in this context.

So how are they “his congregation devotees”? Or is this the basic misunderstanding that is propelling him to act likewise angrily.

As Dayalu Prabhu did not follow through with this practical approach of forming a TP body, so what should I do? Tell me if any devotee has trouble with Dayalu Prabhu whom is he going to approach, especially when there is no GBC.  Is Dayalu Prabhu or Mmp or myself perfect that they will not make mistakes or take wrong decisions? Do you think Srila Prabhupada wanted an ISKCON of overlords with no one to answer to?

Ironic is that Dayalu Prabhu is accusing me of acting as if there is no one over me. But at least I want this to happen and have been in the process to form these group of TP/Preaching center heads bodies as the 1st step in electing GBCs from among them all over the world. Currently our cooperation in North America is not so advanced to speak of a TP body of devotees but I do answer to diff bodies in my various services and legally they have power to over see me.

Hence I wanted this to be formed at least here in Rajasthan so that the valid issues with me while executing preaching projects in Rajasthan that Dayalu Prabhu has raised, this same body can deal with in a cooperative organized manner.

Otherwise Dayalu Prabhu had declared unilaterally before the Prabhupadanugas festival that “Nimai is not allowed do any project in India (or Rajasthan- I forgot which)”!

Hence feeling the need to resolve the issues that I had with Dayalu Prabhu so that we can all preach organizedly and having no other recourse to approach anyone else, and as I am also preaching here in Rajasthan for many years, also have been fortunate enough to be advising almost all the senior devotees including your good self, in and around Jaipur including Dayalu Prbahu and Mmp, as I was already doing this duty of advising against deviations in so many cases I can recount over the years as you may well recall and even before you came to the center, as I have been already doing the duty of trying to inpire all of the devotees including your good self, so as to be able to approach Srila Prabhupda directly and personally through his books and lectures and letters, by reading studying him and inquiring…and as Dayalu Prabhu is my dear friend still and kept writing to me for responding for advise on some issues, and as some devotees brought these similar issues with him to me, and as I am truly very disturbed that the path to continue taking shelter of Srila Prabhupada is being disturbed for you all, I was forced to tackle this problem head on – in the best possible way I could think of – to contact the same TP kind devotees in Rajasthan and attempt to hold an Istagosthi at your center in front of deities, Srila Prabhupada and mainly these Vaisnavas and if Dayalu Prabhu wanted, then a few senior brahmacaris.

So that is what I did.

Please have HKC let me know is there anything wrong in that? What other recourse do I have?  Whom else should I approach for resolving issues with Dayalu Prabhu when I cannot resolve them with him personally?

If in trying to utilize this process for resolving these issues, I have caused anyone to be alarmed unnecessary or caused any one of you any grief, I am well and truly sorry for it. In hindsight I ought to have made it clear to Dayalu Prabhu that I am hoping Chanchal Prabhu could act as mediator to organize the Istagoshti and hence for any information or any confirmation of any doubt Dayalu Prabhu could have asked him, and if he had wanted to he could approach me. I did not make it clear. I did request Chanchal Prabhu to act as a mediator though.

Earlier Chanchal Prabhu on his own went to meet Dayalu Prabhu before contacting me and then in the evening came to me on his own accord to try to see if we can have a meeting. So I told him I would be glad and gave him possible dates, informed him who would I am hoping can come and as for topics, I told him I was writing to Dayalu Prabhu an email so that he has in writing the various issues I want discussed as well as the sastric basis for it.

I could have made it clear to him that I have not contacted anyone else nor anyone else is involved. This is all in hindsight now looking back. At that time I could not think that you all would develop all these extreme misunderstandings to this process I am trying to follow to resolve these issues.

Extreme misunderstanding and extreme overreaction as now I have been told that

1. You all are thinking I am trying to call all members to remove Dayalu Prabhu as TP of HKC!!!!!, (what nonsense!)

Is there any basis whatsoever for this allegation? This is totally unbelievable. I do not know if these 6 devotees are current members of HKC or not. But it could have been easily found out by calling all the members of HKC and seeing if I have contacted them or anything of that sort.

What kind of talk was told to you all to make you believe all these things?

2. That it is an “Attack of Nimai Pandit on HKC  - Ludicrous!

Please do let me know after reading this email what was the attack?

3.    That I am getting a prostitute to call you - I have never in my almost 20 years in ISKCON heard this kind of low false talk made to smear someone!- of course there will be no proof but that does not stop you all from propagating it!

4.    That Nimai Pandit is here to destroy the preaching here (when it is just the opposite!).

5.    That we are going to loose the Lawsuit in LI this Nov so I am trying to get a foothold in Jaipur” – Unbelievable that these kind of talks or any other rumors told by people who want to see me fail like Veda Guhya Prabhu, who are opposing us legally, is entertained. What is the substantiated basis for this? Any factual basis. It is another almost a year till the Trial will be held for everyone’s information and our chances to win are excellent as the judge himself has observed in writing twice.

You called me 2 days back and started berating me in a derogatory way. I heard from others that you and Arjuna Prabhu are doing it all around, challenging way, barely seem to be constraining the urge to beat me up!

Is that what you have heard and learned from Srila Prabhupada?

What I feel is similar to those devotees who earlier dared to raise issues with the Gurus, which their blind followers could not tolerate, and hence raised threats while some devotees were even beaten. I have myself been subjected to similar threats thrice earlier – In BLR from the Guru-vadi congregations when incited by their guru when he thought that “he was being offended”, in Juhu temple when the guruvadis wanted to kill me as I had replied to a young devotee Gaurangasundar (Gaurav then) when asked who is my Guru – “Jayapataka swami initiated me but Srila Prabhupada is everything for me” and then in Long Island temple – when the Guru vadis barged into the temple and wanted to kick us all out particularly me as I had dared to be “offensive” to their gurus and GBC by not accepting their instruction to not have Srila Prabhupada as guru and have continued with their combined threats all these almost 10 years!

Prabhu I am not finding any difference now then from those circumstances in terms of sentimental fanatic reaction because I dared to question your leader’s surrender to Mmp and Mmp’s qualification!!, that too only among a select few senior devotees running their independent preaching!

I dare say that you are all by your own reactions in fact proving to all Prabhupadanugas worldwide what I wanted to bring to the notice of only the few mature devotees here

that Dayalu Prabhu is becoming a fanatic blind follower of Murali Mohan Prabhu, and that now all others as his followers are being incited by him to go on a “warpath” and this is the danger of following a still immature devotee like Mmp.

As all can see, this is what I saw in my last personal talk with Dayalu Prabhu and Mmp - that there is no chance I can sit down alone and “peacefully” discuss these issues with him. Hence I have been trying to organize the Istagoshti with the involvement of a few senior devotees, by first writing the issues with their philosophical basis to them.

The only good reaction that you all have done in this aspect is to hold a 24 hour kirtan at the center. Even though it is done to “protect the center from Nimai Pandit’s attack!”

As all who know me Prabhu that none of these kind of “threats” or “attacks” bother me much anymore as “Rakhe Krishna Mare ke, Mare Krishna rakhe ke”. What can anyone else do?

Hence it is funny to see this reaction to say the least. Also sadness at the direction this has gone and I am partly to be blamed for this as I write earlier.

Hence I say this is a false alarm and to humor myself and trying to see a positive from this I quote the Nectar of Devotion-

One of the elderly friends said, "My dear Maṇḍalībhadra, why are you wielding a shining sword as though you were running toward Ariṣṭāsura to kill him? My dear Baladeva, why are You unnecessarily bearing that heavy plow? My dear Vijaya, don't be unnecessarily agitated. My dear Bhadravardhana, there is no need to make these threatening motions. If you will all look more closely you will see that it is only a thunder cloud upon Govardhana Hill; it is not the Ariṣṭāsura in the shape of a bull, as you have imagined."

These older, well-wishing friends of Kṛṣṇa had imagined a large cloud to be the Ariṣṭāsura, appearing in the shape of a huge bull. In the midst of their excitement one of them ascertained that it was actually only a cloud on Govardhan Hill. He therefore informed the others not to take the trouble of worrying about Kṛṣṇa, because there was no present danger from Ariṣṭāsura.
(Nectar of devotion - Chapter Forty-one)

Even though this is a lofty comparison, I hope you all will similarly quieten this mob mentality, instruct all to follow the Vaisnava etiquettes as Srila Prabhupada would want them to be followed to protect all from unnecessary offenses.

As for the Istagosthi, to make sure that the proceedings go forward smoothly, and that we actually achieve meaningful discussions, I am proposing:

1.    That the topics for the Istagosthi ought to be decided upon now before hand.
I propose that I offer 3 main topics of discussion and you all/Dayalu Prabhu offer 3 topics. We start by discussing 1st one topic of either mine or his, then the 1st topic of the other one, etc. We can decide whose topic to start discussing 1st by a system of chits or whatever, I do not care as long as we both get chance to have our topics discussed one after other without the whole discussion becoming an angry crowd crusade or a mob attack.
2.    We need to decide beforehand which devotee will facilitate the Istagosthi or a group of 3 devotees who can mediate, keep the discussion on the topics, keep to the time, and allow each concerned one to speak or defend oneself. I have brought up some issues so Dayalu Prabhu and Mmp ought to get time to defend this and similarly I be allowed to explain these in detail if required. Similarly his issues with me vice versa.
3.    I also propose that the meeting be recorded by video so that all what was discussed can be, if required, sent to any senior devotees around the world for confirmation or rebuking of what I am saying.
4.    Also the participants at the Istagoshti need to be finalized beforehand. Earlier I wanted mainly the mature senior devotees preaching heads and whoever Dayalu Prabhu wanted. But now seeing this incited mob mentality among the poor devotees I want that for the sake of sane serious discussion ON THE TOPICS, the list of final devotees who will be present be agreed upon by the end of today 4th Nov.

Basically if you want a mob lynching, then you can find someone else. That is not a Vaisanava principle nor instructed by Srila Prabhupada hence I am not interested. If HKC wants serious discussion, back and forth giving enough time to each to speak/defend, then I am ready and agreeable to come and participate willingly and happily 6th Nov morning 10 am.

I will come alone.

I have certain issues that are important for the sake of spiritual life of all devotees there, foremost for my dear friend Dayalu Prabhu and then Mmp and all of you too, whom I have seen grow more and more under the shelter of hearing of Srila Prabhupada only, and that is what I want to see continue happen.

I know Dayalu Prabhu has some issues with me, so let us work on a framework to get this organized today and tomorrow so that the Istagosthi day after tomorrow pleases Srila Prabhupada.

“First hearing, then chanting. Hear from the right source and discuss amongst yourselves. Iṣṭagoṣṭhi.”
(Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.5.13 -- New Vrindaban, June 13, 1969)

“we got your new books, Caitanya-caritāmta. So we were reading constantly from early in the morning. We found it was very enlivening, the fact that we were reading amongst a number of devotees.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore it is called iṣṭagoṣṭhī, or discussion.”
(Morning Walk, September 9, 1975, Vndāvana)

“Please accept my blessings. I am in receipt of a copy of your last Istagosthi dated Jan. 27, and I am very much satisfied with your replies on the questions made in the Istagosthi. The meeting is called "Istagosthi'' and not "Istagosthi''
(Letter to: Satsvarupa -- Los Angeles 25 February, 1968)

Please accept my blessings. I am in due receipt of your letter dated March 19th, along with Istagosthi notes, I am always so pleased to see how nicely the Istagosthi meetings are being carried on, so I am always anticipating your letters, along with Istagosthi reports. Thank you very much. 
(Letter to: Balai -- San Francisco 22 March, 1968)

Again, please forgive any of my offenses in bringing up these issues and the disturbance this has caused among you involuntarily.

Let us discuss the issues on Sastric basis one by one so that these are cleared up and then we can all preach in a cooperative manner all over Rajasthan and then the world.

Remaining your aspiring servant,
Nimai Pandit Das

For Part 2: CLICK HERE
For Part 3: CLICK HERE
For Part 4: CLICK HERE
For Part 5: CLICK HERE
For Part 6: CLICK HERE
For Part 7: CLICK HERE

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